title: "111a. Special Episode - Live from COP28 in Dubai. With Bruce Douglas, CEO Global Renewable Alliance, on 3xRenewables"
author: "Redefining Energy"
source_type: podcast
content_hash: 8f342adf5a49b8ffad15049a3b579ebbf3af932c964234b928986d6d8b0a9967
With Laurent's segel and from London and Gerard read from Berlin. This is redefining energy minutes. It is A ninety six and we are live from Dubai Cup twenty eight with rock Star as guest Bruce Douglass. Great to be here, Laurent Gerard. Always a pleasure, so I can just kick off and just ask a question. I've never been to COP, so maybe you could just explain to me and also for our just our listeners, what COP is all about. Yeah, Jered, I mean probably first to say you're fortunate probably never to been at COP. It's it's you need some stamina, let me say. But listen, it's the center of the world for climate negotiations. There's several parts to it. One is the Green Zone, you know, sort more business oriented, and then there's the Blue Zone, which is more the country pavilions, and that's where we're located. So we have a joint pavilion with the International Venewable Energy Age. See that's IRENA called the Global Renewables Hub. For the first time there's actually a renewables focused center to what's going on. And then there's the negotiations that are going on as well, which we're part of. So I have to say that for the first time ever, the private sector and more importantly, the renewables industry, is really welcome and we're at the center of what's going on. And people have even dubbed this cop COP twenty eight as the renewables cop. It's a great signal for what we're trying to do. Wow, I mean, it's great that people wait a twenty eight cup to realize that Webbird's part of the right. So what I've been saying in some of my speech is, yeah, it took twenty five years to be an overnight success. You know, we know guys how hard that's been, but we're getting there. You've been promoting spearheading a simple message, double is it doubled down on the edguy efficiency? Because even I get I get this, but it's very simple, and it seems to have literally caught fire, and I see not everywhere. So can you explain a bit how that message becomes so powerful? Well, you know, climate generally and energy specifically and renewables. It's complicated, as you know, and what we tried to do is boil it down to as simple as possible. And what we worked out with Irena through their WITO report is the most cost effective and efficient way to decarbonize the power sector by twenty thirty is to double the rate of energy efficiency and triple the capacity of renewables globally to at least eleven thousand giga whatso, and that message has taken off our strap line is as you say, double down, triple up. If it's taken off so much, it's pretty much a meme here in everyone seems to be saying it, including I was on a panel with the UK Energy Minister and just before I spoke, he said the key to unlock the clean energy future is to double down and triple up, so he stole my line before I could speak. But you know, that's the level of impact we're having, super super positive. I will just add that what we've also seen is one hundred and twenty five so far, and I think it's even more than that. Now. One hundred and twenty five countries have endorsed this tripling pledge, so that's really significant. We see it as a historic moment in the development of the renewables industry and probably the start of the paradigm shift to a new energy future. Can I maybe just just gone back into a club just to explain to me then comes out of it right certainly? You know, what difference does it make to us going forward? Yeah, it's a great question, Gerard, because it's a very opaque world. The negotiations are done behind the scenes. I mean it includes all one hundred and ninety seven countries. You know, basically all countries in the world are involved in negotiations, and they split into different groups depending on region and type, and so there's a small island state group and so they have these negotiations behind the scene. On the text. The text that's important for us is the energy text. It's paragraph thirty five for those who are into it, have a look. Includes you know, the tripling of renewables and doubling advantage efficiency so far in the draft. It also includes text on the phasing down or out of fossil fuels and so forth. But that's what's being discussed now. An outcome at the end is the important cover text. So that's the negotiated final text, which then sets the scene for the future steps. This cop is important because it's the global stock take. So it's the first time in you know, a number of years where they sit down and add up you know, where we are compared to where we want it to be. And you know, we have to say that the NDCs, that's the national determined contributions from the countries. When you add them all up, we are way off track from where we need to be for the one point five degree pathway. And that's the urgency. So that's the message we're sending. It seems to be getting some traction. There's always it's a hot discussion. You know, one could argue, what's the value of it coming out? It has to be strong, unambiguous language with targets ideally legally binding, with a review process, so all that needs to be there for it to have teeth and have to countries then have to be accountable for getting it delivered. And I think it's very important to also have the business in the other zone. Forgot. Yeah, because you have a blue ribbon, so I guess you must be in the blue zone. That's it. Yeah, because the business show, I mean the people who come and I'm sure there's always the guy winging, but most of the people come with solutions. And what I remember from the whole world of cop is that they are working on studies which has been done three, four or five years ago to make their kind of progress report and so on. And in fact, the technology is going so fast that they just come keep up. I'm sure they still have panels at fifty cents per what in their reports and you need to say, guys, no, no, it's ten cents for what now. So the interaction of the business and the negotiator, which is probably the only time in the year that they're going to connect at some point, is for me very positive Or am I just like daydreaming? No, you're absolutely right, Lahore. I mean, for the first time ever, we're seeing that positivity and dynamism of the venew bus industry trans lating into the policy world. So it's not the first time. This year we were in the New York Climate Week, same vibe pre cop meeting in Abu Dhabi there again we were one of the only private sector organizations there with seventy ministers. But you're absolutely right, it's really a sea change, and it's because of the technology. Not only is it mature, we're breaking records of installations year by year, and of course the costs are now very load as long as they need to be to be cost competitive with fossil fuels and pretty much all markets around the world. So there's some really good news stories. The challenge now is getting it done and you know very well, you know on your podcast you go into this in great detail, and permitting, grids, financing, value chains critical pieces for the scaling of renewables. Interestingly, we as the Global Renewables Alliance, we're partnering with long duration energy storage and green hydrogen so we can scale you know, the renewables globally at the same time as have a stable flexible energy system deconnectors very important. Absolutely no transition without transmission and storage and flexibility. Of course, can I ask you just the one technology you've left out is nuclear And there has been a lot of talk about nuclear alliances and this, that and the other thing. I mean, just what's your what's your sense of that? Well, yeah, I mean, you know, the Global Renewables Alliance we don't talk much about nuclear. As you can imagine, it plays a role as a low carbon power generation source. You know, let's put it in context. I think there's like four hundred nuclear power stations globally currently and about what is it three hundred and something gigawatts. We need to scale zero carbon power generation fast by twenty thirty. I don't know. You know, the timeframes for nuclear don't allow that. There is a call here for tripling of nuclear. Twenty or so countries signed onto that, but that's by twenty fifty, So timeframe is significantly different. You know, we need to act now and scale zero carbon generation as fast as possible. Yeah, so renewables is the way to go. We see it as a once in a generation open tunity now to scale renewables. We're feeling that there's a you know, there's a lot of momentum behind what we're trying to do. Okay, so now I don't want to throw flowers at you, but we get very emotional every time we see you shaking hands of the world leaders. You shakenn with Michael Bloomberg, with a Sultan al Jaber? Who else have you met? I like a bit of gossip here, Oh that's a long list, guys. I mean, honestly, it's been the most intense week in my life, without a doubt. You know, I've had some interesting peaks in my career, but this has been, without doubt, the most interesting and valuable, I would say. So I've met probably and spoken to over fifty heads of state and ministers over the last few days. One of the most impressive I've say is President Ruto of Kenya. His vision for how renewables can play a positive role in Africa was extremely significant, and we had several meetings with his team and then a round table I attended where we had forty five ministers talking exclusively about the tripling of renewables and how to get it done. And there, you know, again the positivity was very high. We now calling for action. So the meetings we're in now, ambition is clear. We talk about the three a's ambition, action and accountability, ambition, TIC it's done, get onto action, get it in the text some strong, unambiguous language, and then get on with the enablers. You know, we need to mobilize finance for emerging markets developing their commodies. We need to shorten permitting times, we need to develop grids, and we need to get diverse and strong supply chains in place. So those are the messages we're sending. It seems to be resonating and at the highest level, Like like you said, you know, We've been meeting with not just industry leaders, CEOs, heads of state, but also financiers, philanthropies, NGOs and everyone now is welcoming that renewables message. It'll be interesting to see how it lands. You know, that's the important thing. Where does it land. We hope it's not a missed opportunity that people grasp this and understand the significant benefits that renewables can bring. You know, I know you two do, but it's the convinced people in the room. I've been meeting, and I've been meeting with oil states, the Global South, or they all have a different position, starting point and need, and we think renewables can feel that. Well, Bruce, what I really like about the message, it's a positive message. It's a message of investment, it's a message of technology. It's a message for the future. And unfortunately, for too long the climate community has been messaging in terms of banning or taxing. I mean, there was something punity in it, whereas I feel the enthusiasm. I feel that we are as a noble community presenting the way out. So first I want to thank you very much. I want to congratulate you. I mean, listen that means a lot coming from you too, A great pleasure to talk to you again. I'll leave you with two words. One it's urgency and one is opportunity. You know, we need to work together for this clean, just and equitable future which renewables brings great to speak to you guys and see you on the other side. Yeah, looking forward to it. Thank you, Bruce, And that was life from Dubai. Was Bruce Duplas MHM.